Finn - Finn profile mixup / please correct

Wow what a nasty message.
It is very clearly explained (IMHO) why we have separate profiles for Odin and Woden.

This is the Master Profile for Woden.
Curator Note from Alex Moes © (5/22/2016):
The Anglo-Saxon Chronicle in naming the lineage of Ida lists Woden as the son of Frithuwulf and father of Beldeg.
Woden is almost universally identified with the Norse god Odin/Óðinn.
Odin, {Norse God}

This is the Master Profile for Odin, {Norse God}.
Curator Note from Alex Moes © (6/1/2016):
The ancestry of this profile represents the Norse mythology per the Prose Edda.

Also see alternate ancestry per Anglo Saxon Chronicle: Odin, {Norse God}

also dating any of these people to 2nd or 5th century is highly speculative rather than a factual statement.

It looks from the About Me as if Finn {Anglo Saxon Chronicle} has been merged with a Finn {Heimskringla}, and that their lines are different.

Finn {Beowulf} seems like he wants to be a third profile.

Still think the tagging methodology I proposed in https://www.geni.com/projects/PROPOSED-Secondary-Source-Only-Profil... might be a good idea, but it never became a clear consensus.

There are 2 Finn's This Finn is higher up in the tree where as the Finn son of Folcwald rulled in the 400's J.R.R. Token studied Finn and even wrote a book. Finn fought in the Battle of Finnsburg
Commanders and leaders
King Finn † of Frisia Prince Hnæf † of the Danish Hocings; Hengest

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Finnsburg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finn_(Frisian)

Finn, son of Folcwald
Reign c. 400
Finn, son of Folcwald, was a legendary Frisian king. He is mentioned in Widsith, in Beowulf, and in the Finnsburg Fragment. He is named in the Historia Brittonum, while a Finn, given a different father but perhaps intending the same hero, appears in Anglo-Saxon royal pedigrees.

He was married to Hildeburh, a sister of the Danish lord Hnæf, and was killed in a fight with Hnæf's lieutenant Hengest after Hnæf was himself killed by Frisians.

A passage from Beowulf as translated by Seamus Heaney (lines 1089–1090) reads:

"Finn, son of Folcwald,
should honour the Danes,..."
A possible reference to a lost tradition on Finn appears in Snorri Sturluson's Skáldskaparmál. Snorri talks of the animosity between Eadgils and Onela (which also appears in Beowulf), and writes that Aðils (Eadgils) was at war with a Norwegian king named Áli (Onela). Áli died in the war, and Aðils took Áli's helmet Battle-boar and his horse Raven. The Danish berserkers who had helped him win the war demanded three pounds of gold each in pay, and two pieces of armour that nothing could pierce: the helmet battle-boar and the mailcoat Finn's heritage. They also wanted the famous ring Svíagris. Aðils considered the pay outrageous and refused.

Finn, the son of Fodepald (i.e. Folcwald) is also mentioned in the pedigree list of Saxon ancestors of the legendary kings of Kent that appears in Historia Brittonum. The Wessex and Bernician royal genealogies in the Anglo-Saxon Chronicle and Anglian collection instead make the Finn in the royal pedigree son of Godwulf, and it is uncertain whether the same heroic Finn was originally intended. Richard North notes that Folcwalda is "identical with the first element of fólcvaldi goða ('ruler of the host of gods') which is an epithet reserved for Freyr". He also notes similarities with "fólkum stýrir ('he leads peoples', Húsdrápa) which celebrates Freyr".[1]

Finn is a central subject of Finn and Hengest, a study of the Finnesburg Episode by J. R. R. Tolkien, edited by Alan Bliss and published posthumously in book form in 1982.

In Germanic mythology, Odin (/ˈoʊdɪn/;[1] from Old Norse Óðinn) is a widely revered god. In Norse mythology, from which stems most of the information about the god, Odin is associated with wisdom, healing, death, royalty, the gallows, knowledge, battle, sorcery, poetry, frenzy, and the runic alphabet, and is the husband of the goddess Frigg. In wider Germanic mythology and paganism, """""Odin was known in Old English as Wōden, in Old Saxon as Wōdan, and in Old High German as Wuotan or Wōtan, all stemming from the reconstructed Proto-Germanic theonym *wōđanaz. """""

Same person Obin=Woden

"Everyone knows" that all the Odins are the same Odin.

But the stories about "him" are not compatible - fathers, sons and wives are all different between the stories.

Representing the Odin stories as multiple Odin profiles is the only reasonable way to represent them on Geni without getting hopelessly tangled up.

try this site http://www.quickwhitefox.com/Adam/Adam.htm

52) Finn, King of Trojans (130-163) Asgard, East Europe

56) Odin (Woden, Woutan), King of Denmark King of Trojans (b 215) Asgard, East Europe

if you do the research properly, it is quite easy to build the tree. But Geni doesn't do the easy way as far as I can tell.

Harald Tveit Alvestrand I am not disputing that " Odin" is a different Odin... what are you saying? Anglo-Saxon royal genealogies Click om the Woden name in this link ... it comes up as Odin.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Saxon_royal_genealogies

He used to be an ancester to me haha, but now only goes to:
Guttorm (Gudrød) Sigurdsson

posting in case this helps is all.

All these are now not in my family
her brother → NN Sigurdsdotter
his wife → Guttorm (Guttormur) Sigurdsson, konge av Ringerike
her husband → Åsa Sigurdsdatter
his sister → Eysteinn Trondsson, King
her husband → Trond Saemingsson of Trondheim
his father → Saemingr Odinsson, King in Hålogaland
his father → Odin, {Norse God}
his father → Baldur Mythologicaly
his son → Brand
his son → Frithogar
his son → Freawine
his son → Thrytho
his daughter → Offa the gentle, king of the Angles
her husband → Wermund, king of the Angles
his father → Wihtleg
his father → Vidigoia (Wihtgeat) of the Goths
his father → Ascaric of the Goths
his father → Ovida, King of the Goths
his father → Knivida, Prince of the West Goths
his father → Filimer, King of the Baltic Goths
his father → Guntheric, King of the Goths
his father → Gjúki, King of the Goths
his father → Berik, King of the Goths
his father → Athra / Annar (Fictional)
his brother → Itermon (Fictional)
his son → Heremod (Fictional)
his son → Sceldwea
his son → Beaw / Beowulf
his son → Tætwa Tecti
his son → Geat / Ját, {Mythological}
his son → Godwulf, {Legendary}
his son → Flocwald
his son → Finn
his son

Wipkje (Winnie) Goeree

The problem Harald alludes to is that according to Snorri Odin's father was Borr, according to the AngloSaxon Chronicles Woden's father was Frithowald.
So the two traditions are incompatible genealogically, Geni is a genealogy website not a competitive mythology website. If we try to represent Woden/Odin as one and the same person we would have to choose one tradition over the other, instead we have tried to present both traditions in a way that is clear and confusing. So far we have only differentiated based on his ancestors but the sons of Odin are also a mish mash of incompatible traditions.
To be honest working this high up in the tree is just that, work not pleasure, hard work in fact and pretty thankless too. With a lot of help and advise from other curators i separated the two traditions into the current MP structure and cleared all the many duplicates but that was quite some time ago and i have no inspiration to revisit.

PS anyone referencing to Asgard being in Eastern Europe is working with theories not facts so anything they say should be taken with a huge grain of salt.

that should be comparitive mythology not competitive :)

Opps "... clear and NOT confusing. .."

Harald Tveit Alvestrand
I agree in principle with you that Finn should be split in 2 or 3 profiles based on what is being posted here.

Please check out the history file web page NOTICE the names are just spelt differently but are the same people just from different sagas.
Also notice the date..
Fin / Finn Godulfing
( c.370s\0 \not 100's like geni says.

http://www.historyfiles.co.uk/KingListsEurope/ScandinaviaAngeln.htm

All you have to do to correct the tree is merge each of the proles of \9 for example Odin and Woden and add a note to the profile " Originator of many Anglian dynasties."

BTW your list Sharyn "Shaz" Proctor (Duthy)
From Odin up is wrong Odin's father was Borr where as Woden's was Frithuwald

From my understanding of the History Files web page Folcwald Finn's father is Godwulf but Geat / Ját, {Mythological} is not Godwulf's father but the pedigree would be

(Kings of Frisia / Friesland)

Richold I Offo

his son ...Odilbold

his son ...Richold II

his son... Beroald

his son .. Godwulf, {Legendary}

his son .. Flocwald

his son .. Finn Folcwalding died C 448

does any else agree?

Godwulf / Gudólfr

Son. Replaced with Folcwald by Nennius.

Fin / Finn Godulfing

Son. Probably based on Finn, king of Frisia.

Frithuwulf

Son. Added to the list by the Lindisware genealogy.

Frealaf / Fridleifr

Son. Probable second son of Finn.

fl c.370s

Freawine

Son. Probably based on Freawine, a king of Old Saxony.

Frithuwald

Son. Added to the list by William of Malmesbury.

Woden / Odin

Son. Originator of many Anglian dynasties.

Alex I understand what you are saying but this profile in question ... his father was not the brother of Richoldus I, king of Friesland {Fictitious}

or as the list says I posted previously "Richold I Offo" We don't know who his father was. It was NOT Godwulf that is for sure.

If " Fin / Finn Godulfing " aka the Finn in question was Woden's 3rd great grandfather. Understand what I am saying here? And his wife was not Hildeburh Folcwalding Van Friesland She should be removed from the tree all together.

Hildeburh the DANE was married to Finn Folcwald King of Friesland. His father
" Folcwald" was a puppet King and nothing further is know about his ancestors

Hildeburh the DANE's father was Hnæf of the Danes is killed at the 'Fight at Finnesburg' in Frisia, as is Finn's eldest son. Finn is subsequently killed by Hengist, great-grandson of Wehta and Hnæf's Anglian comrade in arms. The fight seems to involves Jutes on both sides, under Anglian and Frisian command, with Gefwulf, possible ruler of the Jutes, numbering amongst the former.

Both Woden and or Odin were born around 215 BC

BTW why is Richoldus I, king of Friesland showing {Fictitious}? He was a real King as were his ancestors and descendants. I do not understand why Geni marks him as being not a real person of the Friesland History.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Norse_poetry

You might want to consult George Homs a fellow curator of this site ... here is his tree on
https://www.genealogieonline.nl/en/stamboom-homs/I60000000011692215... Even hen agrees with me

This name has come down into many Germanic languages: as Modern English Woden; Old English (and Old Saxon) Woden; Old Franconian Wodan; Alemannic Wuodan; German Wotan or Wothan; Lombardic Godan. Since most Germanic mythological literature was preserved in Old Norse, the name is usually written "Odin" in Modern English rather than the native "Woden."

Odin, the wanderer.Contents [hide]
1 General characteristics
2 Receiver of the Dead
3 Odin and Mercury
4 Etymology
5 Eddaic Odin
5.1 Attributes
5.2 Names
6 Anglo-Saxon Wõden
7 Worship
7.1 Sacrifices
7.2 Shamanic traits
7.3 Odin and Jesus
8 Medieval reception
8.1 Persisting beliefs in Odin
9 Modern age
10 Literature
11 Reference works

Wipkje, as you can see from the dead "edit" links, most of the article you point to is quoted from Wikipedia.

I'm afraid that when you're discussing with people who've read the sagas and poems that these pages are based on, you won't get much benefit from requoting other community-sourced pages.

As a rule of thumb, anything written after 1500 about Odin should be regarded as a secondary or tertiary source - the important part of it is "what source does he quote".

Let’s stick with straightening out the Finn’s, please. The Odins and Wodens are a different topic. I wish to close out the Finn case so I’m no longer needed.

I agree with the “split Finn” proposal.

Many of my sources are from the History files site. BTW better than Wikipedia

Finn should be after "woden" as his 3rd great grandfather NOT brother of Richoldus I, king of Friesland ... sources say that Finn King of friesland ( not this Finn) may have been "Richold I Offo" or as on Geni Richoldus I, king of Friesland.

Richoldus I, king of Friesland was never known as the son of Godwulf, {Legendary} This should be changed