Oria Ibn Lopo ibn Musa - Strange name

Started by Private User on Wednesday, August 10, 2016
Showing all 13 posts
Private User
8/10/2016 at 3:34 PM

If the people or persons who cut of her father Lope ibn Musa بن موسى did this because there was no contemporary sources that proved that relationship, also could have been smart enough to cut her name so that it match this new solution all could be well, but otherwise, it's looks like a trash work by some unfitted person who really do not know what he or she was doing, seriously? Why keep a name that you (all by you self ) do not believe to be accurate? Are you joking?

8/10/2016 at 3:54 PM

Thanks for the feedback, Ulf. I did it, and I left the name as is intentionally so that it would get further attention, either by me when I have more time or by one of the other curators who can see at a glance that Oria, being a woman, would not be an "ibn". Incremental progress, my friend.

Private User
8/11/2016 at 8:59 AM

Okay, feel free to do what you're doing, find this on French wiki, where she's just called Oria bint Musa, another name I found for her was Aurea.

Musa ibn Musa

Lubb II ibn Musa (-875)
Ismail ibn Musa (-889)
Mutarrif II ibn Musa (-873)
Fortún II ibn Musa (-874)
Oria bint Musa, mariée à un prince basque García (-859) et mère d'un Musa2. Selon Christian Settipani, García serait un fils de García Galíndez le Mauvais, comte d'Aragon, et Oria et lui auraient pu avoir aussi pour fille Oria (Aurea) épouse de Fortún Garcés3.


Then the thing about not contemporary sources, if they were written 1-200 years after that she supposed to have lived, do you have any proof of that they are false?

Private User
8/11/2016 at 9:30 AM

One of the few private sites that I found calls her "Aurea Ibn Musa", but yet again, it should have been "Bint" instead of Ibn.

Fortun von Pamplona
830-> 905
Aurea Ibn Musa

Private User
8/11/2016 at 9:37 AM

A temporary solution would be to name her; Oria (Aurea) Bint N.N.

8/11/2016 at 11:30 AM

Lots of things we "could" do. Better to wait until someone has some time to actually review and evaluate the evidence. I don't mind cutting a fake line when someone has an emergency over it, but I prefer to take time to examine the evidence and detail the profile rather than just slapping in a bunch of other changes. It's already on my list. I'll get there if someone else doesn't beat me to it.

Private User
8/11/2016 at 1:00 PM

Sounds good Justin, because I thought that the only reason for cutting this line was because that someone had exposed it as false, if that proves to not be the case, it might be reestablished, maybe with a note saying "possible or plausible" father"?

8/11/2016 at 2:00 PM

No, it truly is false. I was cutting some of the fake lines to Muhammad that I could easily recognize. This was one of them. There are no contemporary sources about her parents, just her own name. The idea she was one of the Banu Qasi is very late, and just a theory based on her name.

I just need to take some time to document all that. Just an hour or maybe two, but it all takes time.

8/11/2016 at 9:31 PM

Okay Ulf. I've done about as much cleanup as I planned to do. The name and text should be much better now. We can see if any other information emerges.

Private User
8/11/2016 at 11:50 PM

Yeah, the surname was just garbage that got merged in later on. I think she should have no parents, and there are no contemporary sources for her parentage. Anything that states otherwise is a modern contrivance to give her legitimaticy.

Private User
8/11/2016 at 11:57 PM

Justin Durand, bravo on the about section! I just noticed it. Yes, I think given the sources you list, she should be disconnected instead of causing false pathways for people.

Private User
8/12/2016 at 7:59 AM

Much better, I agree!

8/12/2016 at 8:39 AM

Thanks! Now only 7000 more profiles to go ;)

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