Oria - Unknown parents

Started by Private User on Friday, December 28, 2018
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Showing 1-30 of 39 posts
Private User
12/28/2018 at 7:55 AM

The note on Oria's master profile says that her parents are unknown. This is also consistent with the historical consensus. However, Geni has her connected to a large family tree. I think she should be disconnected from her parents unless there's good evidence for her ancestry.

12/28/2018 at 10:10 AM

Agreed and done. The notes are quite clear. Thank you for calling attention.

Private User
12/28/2018 at 1:22 PM

Yes, destroy others made connections without consulting them asking how or why they connected them, bravo!

Noah, guess you're not connected to the world tree at all, so how come that you, just you? raised the demand of cutting my 35th great grandmother from her supposed parents?

Erica, why didn't you asked the one/s who made the connection before just jumping in and do your cut?

12/28/2018 at 1:32 PM

Because I could see from revisions that a merge was made that re- dragged in parents “previously disconnected.”

The curator note dates from 2011. Possible parentage is described and linked in the “about.” And Geni says she’s my 35th gg.

Can you help me find how she’s not my ancestor? That would be more useful ...


12/28/2018 at 1:35 PM

I should also say that I’ve worked with Noah for a while and know him to be a reliable historian. He’s been a tremendous asset in helping sort a confused and controversial line with me, for example.

Private User
12/28/2018 at 2:06 PM

But I am curious about the people/s behind the reconnection explanations and motif behind it, now I feel robbed.

12/28/2018 at 4:34 PM

Look at the revision tab. I read it as merge without looking at notes, and therefore, a simple error to be corrected.


Private User
1/3/2019 at 7:59 AM

There has been really weird conversations where it is easy to see, there are religious bias behind the cutting and changing lines. (No nad ill here but usually by jewish and muslims fate.)Those kind of things, biases should not be allowed in geni. I have been following conversation about King David and there the mission is cutting all the lines that are connected to King David through muslims, it was done by curators help. The language that are used, is not propiate there. More and more I have seen this coming an issue. Also seeing "private profile" accounts made to saudi arabian people born year 600, also jewish lines, it is weird. There are people who are not interested having big world tree and all us connected, vice versa. That is sad. In Orias case also the connection to her daughter has been cut and daughter has had many different profiles. In some other cases the connections are saved for less reasons, there are no consistent, coherent rules in Geni and sometimes lines are cut without leaving even the hypotesis. That is bothering. Anyway - good new year for everybody.

Private User
1/3/2019 at 11:12 AM

Private User I agree unfortunately, I have also noticed that thing going on here under the two latest years, pretty soon, very few europeans will be related to the ancient worlds profiles here on Geni if that ill manor continues. Already, allmost all connections to the old Armenians kings are cut, almost all connections to the Syrians, he Persians king, the Romans emperor, the Greek and the Pharaons etc.

Private User
1/4/2019 at 10:39 AM

I feel your frustration and see the same push to cut.

Magic eraser of history, Spain and Portugal have strong "Golden Era" Jewish and Muslim history.

Why are we washing it away?

Private User
1/5/2019 at 10:06 AM

And specially in Spain all still living side by side, participating each others many costumes peacefully. But there are other types of people unfortunately also. It gave me chills to read this conversation and what it is about: https://www.geni.com/discussions/188114

I wonder if we all would talk like that about other religions shockingly and make cuts to the directions we want to see hmm.. "Washing" history is still a problam sadly.

Private User
1/5/2019 at 1:10 PM

Yes Saga and Anwar Michael, It really feels like a washing, but done on both sides of the coin by both of the opposite groups, but unfortunately, to proove it, that is hard, or almost impossible.

To their support is the common lack of real genuine contemporary sources, all we have is often reconstructed sources with little to none value. But It still nevertheless feels like it ends out in a dual battle of racism wherein they are winning more and more land with an ugly oncoming future for us to meet.

Private User
1/7/2019 at 5:03 AM

I've stopped considering Geni for a long time as a research tool. I have not been to the forums for months! Lots of people intervening, making decisions on their own! I'd rather build my tree offline with other tools. Geni is just fun for me! Since I have no power over my "foreign" ancestors, I stopped bothering with my lost ancestry in Geni! Do not get angry! At the end of it all, we all descended from the same ancestors! Like it or not!

Private User
1/7/2019 at 9:10 AM

That is so true cousins. Sandro, do you have good suggestion for offline tools? Have a Good New Year all :)

Private User
1/9/2019 at 11:08 AM

Hello Saga! Happy New Year to everyone in this great tree!

I use MyHeritage's Family Tree Builder without connecting to the web (sometimes I connect). I like its features!
I still have FamilySearch's Personal Ancestral File (PAF) in its latest version 5.2.18. Many people still use it. Get it on: https://archive.org/details/PAF5EnglishSetup.
I like GenoPro because sometimes I like to "draw" my tree more freely, no automatic positioning arrangements.

A good search in Google, as "best genealogy softwares" or "best free genealogy softwares" can give you a direction. For example:(https://www.toptenreviews.com/software/articles/the-5-best-free-gen...)

I have the following softwares (At some point I tested them! But it does not mean that they are installed today):

Ancestris, GenealogyJ, GeneWeb, GenoPro, My Family Tree, Ancestral Quest, Family Historian, Family Tree Legends, Gramps, Legacy, RootsMagic, Visual Family Tree Maker, extension for SmartDraw, Ahnenblatt...

I use other genealogy sites (I not to put all the eggs in the same basket). Some are regional, from my country. The other best known are MyHeritage, FamilySearch, GeneWeb and Ancestry.

To summarize: I use PAF (it's a classic), MyHeritage's Family Tree Builder and GenoPro.

1/9/2019 at 6:18 PM

Just 'throwing this out there.'

Wikipedia, and yes we know, it's resourcefulness is questionable by many, reports a daughter Auria (Oria?):

Musa ibn Musa is reported by the Códice de Roda to have married a daughter of his half-brother Íñigo Arista.[5] She was not his only wife, as he also married a cousin Maymuna (Arabic: ميمونة‎), daughter of his paternal uncle Zahir ibn Furtun and mother of his younger son Isma'il. No source reports the mother of his other sons: Lubb, Mutarrif and Furtun. He had at least two daughters; Auria (Arabic: اوْرية‎, Awriyah), wife of Basque prince Garcia, killed at Mount Laturce, and by him having a son Musa ibn Garshiya; and another daughter, "the most beautiful girl in Al-Andalus", married to Azraq ibn Mantil.

The Códice de Roda or Códice de Meyá (Roda or Meyá codex) is a medieval manuscript that represents a unique source for details of the 9th and early 10th century Kingdom of Navarre and neighbouring principalities. It is currently held in Madrid as Real Academia de la Historia cód. 78.

1/9/2019 at 6:21 PM

I put the last piece of info in because this discussion has devolved and gone off track of: Who were the parents of Oria.

1/9/2019 at 6:44 PM

Marvin Loyd Welborn Have you read the Links in the profile overview?

1/9/2019 at 6:47 PM

yes, and still trying to 'digest' them....I looking in FMG right now....

1/9/2019 at 6:56 PM

here's something under FMG:

MUSA ibn Musa, son of MUSA ibn Fortun & his second wife... had [seven] children by unknown [wives/concubines]:

6. [AWRIYA] binti Musa . Her parentage and marriage are confirmed by the Chronicon Sebastiani which records that "Muza…genere suo…Garseane" was killed at the battle of Monte Laturce against Ordoño I King of Asturias [in 859][494]. Ibn Hazm names "Awriya" as the daughter of "Musa ibn Musa", adding that she married "Garsiya rey de los Vascos" and names their son "Musa ibn Garsiya"[495]. m GARCÍA, son of --- (-killed in battle Monte Laturce 859).

1/9/2019 at 7:01 PM



1. GARCÍA, son of --- (-killed in battle Monte Laturce 859). Ibn Hazm names "Awriya" as the daughter of "Musa ibn Musa", adding that she married "Garsiya rey de los Vascos" and names their son "Musa ibn Garsiya"[39]. This García has not otherwise been identified in the families of the early kings of Pamplona/Navarre. One possibility is that the sources have misnamed him and that he is the same person as Galindo Iñíguez, son of Íñigo "Arista" [King] of Pamplona (see below, Part B.), who converted to Islam, probably had a Muslim wife, and is recorded as having a son named Musa. m [AWRIYA], daughter of MUSA ibn Musa. Her parentage and marriage are confirmed by the Chronicon Sebastiani which records that "Muza…genere suo…Garseane" was killed at the battle of Monte Laturce against Ordoño I King of Asturias [in 859][40]. Ibn Hazm names "Awriya" as the daughter of "Musa ibn Musa", adding that she married "Garsiya rey de los Vascos" and names their son "Musa ibn Garsiya"[41]. García & his wife had one child:
a) MUSA ibn Garsiya . Ibn Hazm names "Awriya" as the daughter of "Musa ibn Musa", adding that she married "Garsiya rey de los Vascos" and names their son "Musa ibn Garsiya"[42].

could this AWRIYA be the Oria we're talking about?


Private User
1/9/2019 at 11:36 PM

This was taken from, "The Great Encyclopedia of Navarre." I then translated it from Spanish to English.


Last Paragraph: Musà achieved such prestige that he
could be rhetorically qualified as "Third King of Spain".
Owner of Arnedo and Tudela, was in charge of the government of Zaragoza by the will of
the new emir Muhammad I, seized Huesca, was given Toledo, who entrusted his son Lubb,
turned his arms against the Alava and against the French county of Barcelona , captured
the Aquitanian counts Sancho and Emenón, and received presents from the Frankish
monarch Carlos el Calvo. His fortune declined as a result of the defeat inflicted on him by
the Oviedo monarch Ordoño I in a second battle of Albelda (859?). The following year he
was deprived of the valium of Zaragoza on the occasion of the aceifa led by the emir
against the lands of Pamplona. Shortly after he found death as a result of wounds received
in a brawl with his son-in-law in Guadalajara.

Last Sentence:

He left four children, Lubb (Lope), Fortún,
Mutarrif and Ismail, and a daughter, Auria (Oria).

Private User
1/9/2019 at 11:39 PM
Private User
1/9/2019 at 11:42 PM

Website appears to be backed by:
Fundación Bancaria Caja Navarra


Private User
1/9/2019 at 11:46 PM

Great Encyclopedia of Navarra (GEN)
The Great Navarra Encyclopedia is the digital version of the encyclopedic dictionary of 11 volumes of the same title, which was promoted and published by Caja Navarra in 1990.

It contains various topics related to art, culture, geography, natural sciences or law.

It is available on the Internet since 2010. The Great Navarre Encyclopedia, printed in 1990, culminated a work begun in 1983.

The online version of this work has more than nineteen thousand voices related to the culture and heritage of Navarre.

Access the Great Navarra Encyclopedia edited by the Caja Navarra Foundation.

Private User
1/9/2019 at 11:54 PM

here's the link to the article about Musa Ibn Musa.

Again, read the last sentence of the writing.


Private User
1/12/2019 at 10:01 AM


seems to need work. everything is twisted in my tree line path.

I am now distantly related with a twist.

Why are all the lines attached to Golden Era Iberian Islam being smashed?

Especially, the ones with ties to European Royalty?

Private User
1/12/2019 at 10:11 AM

I found this:

can curator fix:

Muza Ibn Fortún ibn Qasi, valì de Zaragoza, Arnedo y de Tudela

Muza Ibn Fortún ibn Qasi, valì de Zaragoza, Arnedo y de Tudela


Private User
1/12/2019 at 12:48 PM

As per my reference above to Musa Ibn Musa being father Oria:

Here is Musa Ibn Musa's profile:
Musa Ibn Musa lbn Qasaw, Walí de Tudela, Huesca y Zaragoza

and his daughter : Awriya binti Musa

Private User
1/12/2019 at 12:50 PM

Here's what looks to be a duplicate: Musa Ibn Musa

Musa Ibn Musa lbn Qasaw, Walí de Tudela, Huesca y Zaragoza

Showing 1-30 of 39 posts

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