William Gilbert - Suspicious

Two different sets of parents, how about contacting the managers???

Elizabeth Gilbert
Birth: circa 1210
Clist Champernowne, Devonshire, England
Managed by: Scott David Hibbard

Daughter of Oliver de Champernon, Knight and Wymarca de Champernon

Elizabeth Gilbert
Birth: Birth estimated between 1483 and 1543
Managed by: Woodman Mark Lowes Dickinson, OBE

Daughter of John Godolphin and Elizabeth Godolphin

Have a look at this Elizabeth Gilbert married to a descendant of William Gilbert born 1204 I think this one who is the daughter of Oliver de Champernon \may be mistakenly added to William Gilbert born 1204 or his descendant William Gilbert

Elizabeth Gilbert

Elizabeth Gilbert

Another descendant of William Gilbert born 1204, this William Gilbert profile with unknown wife

William Gilbert, of Bridge Ruh, Cornwall

https://books.google.com/books?id=JL4UAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA131&lpg...

This bit on pp. 130-1 of American Ancestry, volume XII (1899) is all I have so far, Erica Howton

Who is Thelma Jean Morrissey?

And are these Williams in Visitations anywhere? I didn’t see him in Devon. What about Cornwall?

Is she time traveling?

Elizabeth de Champernon

Note: Vivian (p. 180) also names a daughter, Elizabeth, wife of William Gilbert, but also shows her as daughter of a much later Oliver Champernoun and his wife Eglina de Valletort. The latter relationship is the correct one.

Another dup of Sir Otho ?

William Gilbert, Il

There are IPMs attached here, they should help:

Sir Otes Gilbert, of Compton (look at the sources tab)

This Sir Otes Gilbert, of Compton has birth date that b 1418 doesn’t match sibling William Gilbert, Il b 1383

I think he’s another Sir Otho. The names Isabella / Elizabeth seemed interchangeable.

https://www.geni.com/merge/compare/4623518556710081734

What do you think?

Comment for research:

“ Research Notes:

The Herald of the Visitation of Cornwall in 1620 (J. L. Vivian) places Elizabeth Hill a generation earlier which, based on the birth date of Elizabeth's husband, is incorrect.”

OK. Got all the Otes Gilbert’s consolidated, but I fear he has too many children.

Also, what is this name?

Thelma Jean Morrissey Wife of William Gilbert

Not a name for 1520.

That Thelma Jean is a wild card, Erica. I don't trust her one bit. :)

Meanwhile though, here is some evidence of another Otes / Othes Gilbert who died 1547, married to Katherine Champernown.

http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1558-1603/member/gi...

https://ukga.org/cgi-bin/browse.cgi?action=ViewRec&DB=13&bo...

Otho > Thomas > Otho

Henry Gilbard Was not a son of Otes. Entirely different family & locations.

That later Otho Gilbert had a notable son.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humphrey_Gilbert

Gilbert was part of a remarkable generation of Devonshire men, who combined the roles of adventurer, writer, soldier and mariner. A. L. Rowse wrote of him as,

an interesting psychological case, with the symptoms of disturbed personality that often go with men of mark, not at all the simple Elizabethan seaman of Froude's Victorian view. He was passionate and impulsive, a nature liable to violence and cruelty – as came out in his savage repression of rebels in Ireland – but also intellectual and visionary, a questing and original mind, with the personal magnetism that went with it. People were apt to be both attracted and repelled by him, to follow his leadership and yet be mistrustful of him.[17]

Vivian, Lt.Col. J.L., (Ed.) The Visitations of the County of Devon: Comprising the Heralds' Visitations of 1531, 1564 & 1620, Exeter, 1895, p. 406. pedigree of Gilbert

Another Otes ...

Sir Geoffrey “Otes” Gilbert

Is Sir Olever Gilbert Kt another name for Otes?

Are Cornish pedigrees always this annoying?

https://archive.org/details/visitationofcoun091874/page/87/mode/1up...+

https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Gilbert-9954 Presents evidence that Alice Mules married a different Otes Gilbert based on age of his son.

Note: This Otes may be one and the same as Otes Gilbert who is known to have married Elizabeth Hill but the age of the William Gilbert the son of the Otes in this profile does not seem to fit with the William of the other Otes based on age as that William would probably need to have been the 1st son. So the two Otes' could be cousins.

Birth year based on age mentioned in 22 Oct 1443 at the Inquisition at Exeter on the death of John Mulys:[1]

....John Mulys died on 13 September last. His kin and next heirs, who are also the kin and next heirs of Joan his first wife, are: William Gylbert , the son of Alice, one of the daughters of John, aged 7 on 25 March last; Joan Dabernon , the daughter of Isabel, the other daughter of John, aged 9 on 10 September last; and Elizabeth Dabernon , the other daughter of this Isabel, aged 7 on 4 August last. William’s marriage pertains by right to his father Otes Gylbert , who survives, aged 26 and more, and not to the king or any other.
8 Nov 1450: Elizabeth Dabernon:[2]

She is the kin and heir of John Mulys, as one of the daughters of Isabel, one of the daughters of John. Majority claimed by John Giffard, her husband. By royal grant, the lands and tenements from her inheritance are in the custody of Otes Gilberd. The escheator of Devon is ordered to prove the age of Elizabeth, who is said to have been born and baptized at Swimbridge, and to warn Otes to be present. [Dorse:] Memorandum that Otes was warned to be at Exeter on 18 November by Nicholas Bokelly, escheator.

—-

I’m going ahead and setting up another Otes.

Otes Gilbert as husband of Alice Mules parents as yet unidentified.

This feels better.

Erica Howton Is she time traveling?

Elizabeth de Champernon

She came through the portal at Skywalker Ranch. ROFL

“In the future, Scotty.”

:)

I love the concept of Time Travel...
I almost named my son Kyle because of the Terminator :)

Anne Brannen “a fine Elizabethan hand” I cannot decipher at all.

https://www.geni.com/documents/view?doc_id=6000000128414774823&

Luckily the sainted Essex Institute published it in actual English (next upload)

Detaching extra children of Otes Gilbert & Elizabeth Hill:

Lady Mary Oram & Galfrid Gilbert

Will add children gone missing, Otys, William and Gefferey.

So - is this William the one in Cornwall? Who married Thelma Jean?

Sir John Gylbert Is not a known child of Thomas Gilbert, of Compton - detached

Thelma Jean makes no sense as a name at this time.

It’s not just the suspicious use of a middle name. The name Thelma wasn’t used in England till the end of the 19th century, to the best of my knowledge. Is it showing up in documentation?

This is all I got so far.

William Gilbert

The visitation of the county of Cornwall, in the year 1620. Author: St. George, Henry, 1581-1644,Lennard, Samson, -1633,Vivian, J. L. (John Lambrick), 1830-1896,Drake, Henry Holman,College of Arms (Great Britain). Page 87. Archive.Org listed as Sir Olever Gilbert, Kt.

https://archive.org/details/visitationofcoun091874/page/87/mode/1up

BTW Robert Gilbert & Galfrid Gilbert were children of Sir Otes Gilbert. Robert was listed in IPM.