Hugh Ross of Halkhead - Hugh Ross of Halkhead really died 1569 in Kindease?

Yes, you seems to have right, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earl_of_Ross had 3 lions in their arms of shield, the decendants of George Ross says have had the same, "There is also a picture of the arms which Williams ssss Herman Ross used when he was enobled in 1819. It shows three walking lions.".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ninian_Ross,_3rd_Lord_Ross

I think this Hugh was mismerged some time in the past.

This was interesting:

http://finlander.genealogia.fi/archive/index.php/t-6259.html

Hugh's father, Hasse suggests, was a Walter Ross of Kindeace, who died in 1569. He was married to Jean Douglas. The documents suggest that a Walter Ross of Kindeace, a generation earlier, was required to pay a lot of money to the Ross clan chief because of properties his wife had inherited. She, too, was a member of the Dunbar family, and the farm referred to was the same one as Hugh's wife a generation later had been involved. The clan Mclead was inportant northern clan, but not resident generally in Easter Ross, and the clan Douglas was a southern group. It is possible that clansmen especially clan chiefs could take their wives from further afield, but the Rosses of Kindeace were not in that category. The Dunbars had been important property owners in Easter Ross in the 16th century, but their properties, too, appear to have been lessening in importance about the same time those of the Rosses of Kindeace were.

I'm not convinced that the clan Ross once championed Norman claims to the throne of Scotland. The Rosses in the 16th and early 17th century were clearly of Keltic or Pictish descent. Later on the properties and rights associated with Balnagown, the seat of the Ross clan head, were sold to another Ross family, resident near Glasgow. This was a Norman family, but by the 18th century had intermarried extensively with Keltic clans. It is well possible that the Kindeace Rosses are ancestral in some way to Rosses of America in the colonial era, but, if so, I have to see the evidence.

William Georgesson Ross (his grandson)

Here’s the Kindease line

Northern Notes & Queries, Volumes 1-4 Page 169

https://books.google.com/books?id=YNtZAAAAIAAJ&lpg=RA2-PA170&am...

Walter Ross, 3rd of Balmachy

This was the bad Hugh Ross merge, I’ve had to rebuild it.

https://www.geni.com/merge/view?revision_id=68225029710

Hugh Ross
Son of; Walter Ross; Jane Douglas
Husband ofKatherine (MacLeod) Ross
Father ofGeorge Ross

These are three different Hugh Rosses proposed (by Geni merges) as fathers of the George Ross who died in Finland (George Ross). So far I am not clear which Hugh he was originally; or which Hugh is accurate.

Hugh Ross of Halkhead

Hugh Ross, 4th of Balmachy

Hugh Ross, 4th of Balmachy

A related discussion:

2/10/2020 at 3:55 PM

“Yet many websites state that the Finnish Rosses are descendants of Ninian Ross, Lord of Halkhead, this is probably not true. The most probable line goes through Rosses of Kindeace (the older branch) to Rosses of Balnagowan. This is backed up by the coats of arms Herman Ross (the last male Ross in Finland) sent to the House of Nobility in Finland. He was not granted permission to use it since he couldn't give documents reliable enough. Anyway, the coat of arms is the one of Rosses of Kindeace, ...”

So I have set George Ross who died in Finland “hooked on” the Kindease line.

Oh good job, Erica Howton. I hadn't come across the Kindease line in
Northern Notes & Queries. I'm going to add all of them to my database.

And I've seen people talking about this Finland line in some Ross discussion somewhere, but I can't remember which line they said they were descended from. I don't think it was in the DNA group. I don't remember seeing any DNA results connected to a tree that goes through Finland. It would be great if we could get someone to test.

I guess, for now, this is 'unresolved' as far as Hugh's parent's go.

When I first saw that he was a 'Halkhead' Ross, I deleted the Ross coat of arms with the 3 lions & uploaded the one with the 3 water bouquets. If he truly is a Kindeace Ross, then I shouldn't have done that. Are you able to reverse it?

I´m Quoting this discussion related to that matter. : https://www.geni.com/discussions/207475

Hannu- Matti Johannes Järvinen wrote:
" Many websites state that the Finnish Rosses are descendants of Ninian Ross, Lord of Halkhead, this is probably not true. The most probable line goes through Rosses of Kindeace (the older branch) to Rosses of Balnagowan. This is backed up by the coats of arms Herman Ross (the last male Ross in Finland) sent to the House of Nobility in Finland. He was not granted permission to use it since he couldn't give documents reliable enough. Anyway, the coat of arms is the one of Rosses of Kindeace,

The problem is that, as far as I know, nobody has found Scottish data about George Ross and his son, William. William was born in 1598, but we don't know much about George. He came to Stockholm in 1617 as you wrote, but there isn't any more information about him. Since his father's name was said to be Hugh, one alternative is Hugh Ross of Kindeace, born 1532, died 1622, but I haven't seen any Scottish documents if he had another son in addition to Walter.

Since I used the coat of arms to connect the Finnish Rosses to Rosses of Balnagowan, I have to note the coats of arms of Rosses of Halkhead in Geni are of Rosses of Balnagowan. I wrote about that to the maintainers but they haven't changed it.
Since I used the coat of arms to connect the Finnish Rosses to Rosses of Balnagowan, I have to note the coats of arms of Rosses of Halkhead in Geni are of Rosses of Balnagowan. I wrote about that to the maintainers but they haven't changed it.

And yes, I'm also a descendant of William Ross."

These are the Participants in the Ross Project at FamilyTreeDNA as it stands now.
http://www.thefryingpan.net/charts/ross-mrca-chart-reorganized.html

I found these documents trustworthy:

https://archive.org/details/cu31924092516248/page/n265/mode/2up

“The Ross Family. Line of Kindeace.” Northern Notes & Queries, vol. 4, no. 14, 1889, pp. 51–74. JSTOR, http://www.jstor.org/stable/25513138. Accessed 31 Jan. 2021.

About Hugh Rosse : https://archive.org/details/cu31924092516248/page/n265/mode/2up?q=H...

By the way, I think I’m also from a Hugh Ross, who was none of the above.

So far I’m not finding George who went to Finland in any Scots source. Has anyone else?

I haven’t tried Rosslandia in detail yet; as we know, it can be hard to interpret that book. But cross referencing with TSP & Notes and Queries, I “think” geni is now correct on these 3 Hughs.

Can someone point me to the correct Kindease coat of arms?

“” . This is backed up by the coats of arms Herman Ross (the last male Ross in Finland) sent to the House of Nobility in Finland. He was not granted permission to use it since he couldn't give documents reliable enough. Anyway, the coat of arms is the one of Rosses of Kindeace,”

We did notice that there were two generations of later legitimized sons around Kindese, right? That could make tracking the family who went to Finland even more difficult,.

And it looks like they “daughtered out” there?

As I wrote in the (now vanished?) discussion thread on Geni about George Ross, THERE is the problem: Geni had it that George had a father Hugh who had the parents Ninian Ross of Halkhead and Elizabeth Stewart. (So far is much accomplished, when Hugh is replaced with the right Hugh who was the son of Elizabeth Ruthwen and Ninian Ross of Halkhead. That is now totally different lines of genealogy.) But still remains that to Sweden came this guy (and how can we find his scottish roots?):
https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/history/ssne/item.php?id=784

https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/history/ssne/item.php?id=7305

Are those blood relatives of this Hugh Ross?

https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/history/ssne/item.php?id=461

Hej Erik. https://blog.zaramis.se/2012/08/22/ross-i-vasa/?fbclid=IwAR0xfqsexS...

Den finska familjen Ross tycks inte ha varit närmare släkt med de grenar av den skotska släkten Ross som på 1700-talet var aktiva som handelsmän i Norrköping (Ross of Kindeace) och Göteborg (Ross of Shandwick).

From that blog you can find many interesting suggestions.

Ah ha.

“William's father (and Herman's grandfather) was George Ross who came from Kindeis in Scotland and who was in debt in Sweden in 1617. He had a brother called Jacob Ross (1636-1687) [SSNE 4940] who was also both merchant and mayor of the town ...”

This is a different line.

Ross and Vaasa
PublishedAugust 22, 2012AuthorAnders_S

The Ross family came to Sweden and Finland as early as the 17th century. A William Ross (1598-1648) settled in Vaasa where he eventually became mayor. Hans was the son of George Ross of Balmachie and Margaret McCulloch . Andrew Ross, a brother of William Ross, was the first Ross of the Ross of Balblair line.

A large number of descendants of William Ross continued to have assignments in Vaasa, several of whom were mayors. Including the sons Henrik Williamsson Ross (1636-87). Jakob Williamson Ross (1634-?) Who was married to Margareta Bochmöller , daughter of Cordt Bochmöller in Nykarleby. Jakob W. Ross was one of the founders of Orisberg's mill .

That’s this William Georgesson Ross, son of George Ross (we took this George off the Halkhead line).

The birth location for William is odd.

Thrilling! Now I see you provide so many good data, I'm so happy if these lines are thorroughly followed and the confusion many of us have or have had til now, will be eased or another achievement to be grateful for.

I’m not sure we’re there yet, but it’s sure looking better. Keep digging.

Private User - Halkhead is wrong. There is no one in that family who could be this George Ross.

I built out the Ross Kinease family based on the sources you mentioned above, which should be good (Scots genealogists). However I don’t yet see a specific possible George in that area. It would not be an armigerous (Arms bearing) line, and there should be local records.

I’ve found a death date of 1665 for Margaret Gordon a theoretical mother of George Ross born 1563.

This doesn’t work at all.

I’ve disconnected. If George who went to Finland was from the Kindease Ross family, it’s an earlier generation. But I suspect this is not where he was from.

So what is wrong with this one?

"The Ross family came to Sweden and Finland as early as the 17th century. A William Ross (1598-1648) settled in Vaasa where he eventually became mayor. Hans was the son of George Ross of Balmachie and Margaret McCulloch . Andrew Ross, a brother of William Ross, was the first Ross of the Ross of Balblair line.

A large number of descendants of William Ross continued to have assignments in Vaasa, several of whom were mayors. Including the sons Henrik Williamsson Ross (1636-87). Jakob Williamson Ross (1634-?) Who was married to Margareta Bochmöller , daughter of Cordt Bochmöller in Nykarleby. Jakob W. Ross was one of the founders of Orisberg's mill ."

Because George Ross, 5th Laird of Balmachy and Margaret McCulloch did not have a William son as far as I can see in Rossiana. Their children were Walter and Andrew.

https://archive.org/details/rossianapapersdo01read/page/42/mode/2up