Charles Constantine, Count of Vienne

Charles (perhaps "Constantine") (c903-c926), Count of Vienne and Bellay (943). The debate about his mother's identity is quite heated. His supposed name or nickname Constantine, unusual in the west, supports the theory, accepted by Septimani, that she was the Byzantine princess Anna Myakes. Flodoard called him Charles Constantine, but the evidence that he used the name in his lifetime is too weak to be reliable. A diploma of his father and his own charters call him only Charles. See Charles Constantine, Count of Vienne: identity of his mother at soc.genealogy.medieval.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Constantine_of_Vienne

Charles-Constantine (died 962) was the count of Vienne, son of Louis the Blind, king of Provence and Holy Roman Emperor.

He was married to Thiberge de Troyes. It has been speculated that Constance, wife to Boso II of Provence and ancestor of the Counts of Provence, was their daughter.

Some modern genealogical scholars speculated that his mother was Anna of Constantinople, daughter of Leo VI the Wise and his second wife Zoe Zaoutzaina.

Sources

   * Dictionnaire de Biographie Française. Roman d'Amat and R. Limousin-Lamothe (ed). Paris, 1967.

The family of Charles-Constantin de PROVENCE and .. [128947] PROVENCE (de), Charles-Constantin (Louis III .. & Anna de MACÉDOINE [128946]), comte de Vienne, born about 901

• married about 920, from France ? (France) .., .. (..)

     1) Constance, born about 925, married about 945 Boso de PROVENCE

Bibliographie : Histoire de la maison royale de France (Père Anselme); Essai sur l'histoire des comtes souverains de Provence

http://www.francogene.com/quebec--genealogy/128/128947.php

Karl Konstantin (* wohl 901, † nach Januar 962) 928/930 Graf von Vienne, ? Teutberga von Troyes († nach 960) Tochter des Grafen Warnarius und Teutberga von Arles Richard († nach Januar 962) Robert († wohl nach Mai 976) Konstanze (Constance) ? Boso II. († 965/967) 935 Graf von Avignon, 949 Graf von Arles (Haus Provence)

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Charles-Constantine (d. 962) was the count of Vienne, son of Louis the Blind, king of Provence and Holy Roman Emperor.

About his name, he was never called "Charles Constantine". Rather Flodoard, copied later by Richar, calls him "Constantinus". We know that his proper name was "Carolus" (Charles) from a diploma of his father, and from his own charters. Modern scholars have typically called him Charles Constantine, but this was not a name used during his lifetime.

Some modern genealogical scholars speculated that his mother was Anna of Constantinople, daughter of Leo VI the Wise and his second wife Zoe Zaoutzaina. However Louis's marriage to this princess is much disputed and is rather unlikely. Christian Settipani postulates that his name refers to the founders of the empires governed by his father and maternal grandfather, i.e., to Charlemagne and Constantine the Great.

Regarding his birthyear, or age, we have few datapoints. He was Count of Vienne and acting as an adult by (but not in) December 927. This evidences that his father must have had a prior union. Some speculation would place him born in 901/3 but this is just a force-fit to allow Anna to be his mother and his father's wife.

When Charles' father Louis died in 929, Hugh of Arles, who was already king of Italy, took over Provence and gave it, in 933, to King Rudolf II of Burgundy. Charles-Constantine for whatever reason, could not inherit his father's right to the imperial throne or his right to rule Provence. This has led many to believe he was, in fact, a bastard. He did however rule the county of the Viennois, until his death in 962.

He was married to Thiberge de Troyes. Their daughter Constance of Vienne was wife to Boso II of Provence and ancestor of the Counts of Provence. [edit]Sources

Dictionnaire de Biographie Française. Roman d'Amat and R. Limousin-Lamothe (ed). Paris, 1967.

Charles-Constantine (died 962) was the count of Vienne, son of Louis the Blind, king of Provence and Holy Roman Emperor.

About his name, he was never called "Charles Constantine". Rather Flodoard, copied later by Richar, calls him "Constantinus". We know that his proper name was "Carolus" (Charles) from a diploma of his father, and from his own charters. Modern scholars have typically called him Charles Constantine, but this was not a name used during his lifetime.

Some modern genealogical scholars speculated that his mother was Anna of Constantinople, daughter of Leo VI the Wise and his second wife Zoe Zaoutzaina. However Louis's marriage to this princess is much disputed and is rather unlikely. Christian Settipani postulates that his name refers to the founders of the empires governed by his father and maternal grandfather, i.e., to Charlemagne and Constantine the Great.

Regarding his birthyear, or age, we have few datapoints. He was Count of Vienne and acting as an adult by (but not in) December 927. This evidences that his father must have had a prior union. Some speculation would place him born in 901/3 but this is just a force-fit to allow Anna to be his mother and his father's wife.

When Charles' father Louis died in 929, Hugh of Arles, who was already king of Italy, took over Provence and gave it, in 933, to King Rudolf II of Burgundy. Charles-Constantine for whatever reason, could not inherit his father's right to the imperial throne or his right to rule Provence. This has led many to believe he was, in fact, a bastard. He did however rule the county of the Viennois, until his death in 962.

He was married to Thiberge de Troyes. It has been speculated that Constance, wife to Boso II of Provence and ancestor of the Counts of Provence, was their daughter. [edit] Sources

   * Dictionnaire de Biographie Française. Roman d'Amat and R. Limousin-Lamothe (ed). Paris, 1967.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Constantine_of_Vienne

Charles Constantine of Vienne

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Charles-Constantine (died 962) was the Count of Vienne, son of Louis the Blind, King of Provence and Holy Roman Emperor.

[edit] Name and maternity

About his name, he was never called "Charles Constantine". Rather Flodoard, copied later by Richar, calls him "Constantinus". We know that his proper name was "Carolus" (Charles) from a diploma of his father, and from his own charters. Modern scholars have typically called him Charles Constantine, but this was not a name used during his lifetime.

Some modern genealogical scholars speculated that his mother was Anna of Constantinople, daughter of Leo VI the Wise and his second wife Zoe Zaoutzaina. However, his father's marriage to this princess is much disputed and rather unlikely. Christian Settipani postulates that his name refers to the founders of the empires governed by his father and maternal grandfather, i.e., to Charlemagne and Constantine the Great.

Regarding his birthyear, or age, we have few datapoints. He was Count of Vienne and acting as an adult by (but not in) December 927. This evidences that his father must have had a prior union. Some speculation would place him born in 901/3 but this is just a force-fit to allow Anna to be his mother and his father's wife.

[edit] Life

When Charles' father Louis died in 929, Hugh of Arles, who was already king of Italy, took over Provence and gave it, in 933, to King Rudolf II of Burgundy. Charles-Constantine for whatever reason, could not inherit his father's right to the imperial throne or his right to rule Provence. This has led many to believe he was, in fact, a bastard. He did however rule the county of the Viennois, until his death in 962.

He was married to Thiberge de Troyes. It has been speculated that Constance, wife to Boso II of Provence and grandmother of Queen Constance of Arles, was their daughter. Through her, Charles Constantine would be an ancestor of the Capetian kings of France and the Norman and Plantagenet kings of England (through Queen Constance's daughter Adela Capet, and Adela's daughter Queen Matilda of Flanders, who married William the Conqueror).

[edit] Sources

   * Dictionnaire de Biographie Française. Roman d'Amat and R. Limousin-Lamothe (ed). Paris, 1967.

This page was last modified on 18 February 2010 at 08:40

Only modern scholars refer to him as 'Charles Constantine' (best way to find info on him). He was actually refered to as 'Flodard'. His proper name was 'Carolus' (Charles).

About his name, he was never called "Charles Constantine". Rather Flodoard, copied later by Richar, calls him "Constantinus". We know that his proper name was "Carolus" (Charles) from a diploma of his father, and from his own charters. Modern scholars have typically called him Charles Constantine, but this was not a name used during his lifetime.

Some modern genealogical scholars speculated that his mother was Anna of Constantinople, daughter of Leo VI the Wise and his second wife Zoe Zaoutzaina. However Louis's marriage to this princess is much disputed and is rather unlikely. Christian Settipani postulates that his name refers to the founders of the empires governed by his father and maternal grandfather, i.e., to Charlemagne and Constantine the Great.

Regarding his birthyear, or age, we have few datapoints. He was Count of Vienne and acting as an adult by (but not in) December 927. This evidences that his father must have had a prior union. Some speculation would place him born in 901/3 but this is just a force-fit to allow Anna to be his mother and his father's wife.

When Charles' father Louis died in 929, Hugh of Arles, who was already king of Italy, took over Provence and gave it, in 933, to King Rudolf II of Burgundy. Charles-Constantine for whatever reason, could not inherit his father's right to the imperial throne or his right to rule Provence. This has led many to believe he was, in fact, a bastard. He did however rule the county of the Viennois, until his death in 962.

He was married to Thiberge de Troyes. It has been speculated that Constance, wife to Boso II of Provence and ancestor of the Counts of Provence, was their daughter.

Charles Constantine of Vienne

Charles-Constantine (died 962) was the Count of Vienne, son of Louis the Blind, King of Provence, and the Holy Roman Emperor.

Name and maternity

About his name; he was never called "Charles Constantine", rather Flodoard, copied later by Richar, calls him "Constantinus". We know that his proper name was "Carolus" (Charles), from a diploma of his father, and from his own charters. Modern scholars have typically called him Charles Constantine, but this was not a name used during his lifetime.

Some modern genealogical scholars speculated that his mother was Anna of Constantinople, daughter of Leo VI the Wise and his second wife Zoe Zaoutzaina. However, his father's marriage to this princess is much disputed and rather unlikely. Christian Settipani postulates that his name refers to the founders of the empires governed by his father and maternal grandfather, i.e., to Charlemagne and Constantine the Great.

Regarding his birthyear, or age, we have few datapoints. He was Count of Vienne and acting as an adult by (but not in) December 927. This evidences that his father must have had a prior union. Some speculation would place him born in 901/3 but this is just a force-fit to allow Anna to be his mother and his father's wife.

Life

When Charles' father Louis died in 929, Hugh of Arles, who was already king of Italy, took over Provence and gave it, in 933, to King Rudolf II of Burgundy. Charles-Constantine for whatever reason, could not inherit his father's right to the imperial throne or his right to rule Provence. This has led many to believe he was, in fact, a bastard. He did however rule the county of the Viennois, until his death in 962.

He was married to Thiberge de Troyes.

It has been speculated that Constance, wife to Boso II of Arles and grandmother of Queen Constance of Arles, was their daughter .Through her, Charles Constantine would be an ancestor of the Capetian kings of France and the Norman and Plantagenet kings of England (through Queen Constance's daughter Adela Capet, and Adela's daughter Queen Matilda of Flanders, who married William the Conqueror).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Constantine_of_Vienne