Dea. John Rogers, of Weymouth

• Deacon John Rogers of Weymouth (m Judith) was not son of Mayflower Thomas Rogers
• Evidence needed to support as the son of Thomas Rogers & Elizabeth “Grace” Rogers

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One of the best sources of help in distinguishing the different John Rogers of early Massachusetts is Josiah H. Drummond, The John Rogers families in Plymouth and vicinity. Portland, Me.: unknown, 1895 (available digitally to Ancestry.com subscribers). WikiTree arborists are using this book to guides the clean up the multiple, duplicative, and often conflated profile pages of the various John Rogers of early Massachusetts.

Through analysis of their chronologies and wills and offspring, Drummond concluded that there were three different men, and then made the case for which one was son of Thomas Rogers of the Mayflower. http://www.wikitree.com/g2g/9466/deacon-john-rogers-weymouth-judith...

1. Deacon John Rogers of Weymouth, Suffolk (not Plymouth) County, MA, weaver, b abt 1610 in England, d. 11 February 1661 (Source: Vital Records of Weymouth, MA to the Year 1850 (NEHGS 1910, 3 volumes); Volume 2 , page 334). The names of his parents are not known. He was married about 1636 (not 16 Apr 1639 as claimed on many web sites) to Judith UNKNOWN—some say French; other say King; in either case, no confirmed documentation of her maiden name has been found. His will was dated 8: 12th month 1660 (abt 8 Feb 1661) and inventoried on 20: 12th month 1660 (abt 20 Feb 1661); his estate was proved 30 April 1661. (Source: “Abstracts of Early Wills,” in NEHGS Register 10 (July 1856):265-266, citing Suffolk Probate #264)

His children, as named in his 1661 will were:

• a. John Rogers (abt 1639); single at time of father’s will; likely he who married 8 Jan 1662 Mary Bates (Source: VR of Weymouth, 2:166) and probably the “Elder John Rogers” who died in Weymouth 28 Feb 1710, age 71 (Source: VR of Weymouth, 2:334)
• b. Mary Rogers (abt 1640) m. 24 Nov 1659 (Weymouth VR 2:166) John Raine (deaths not recorded in Weymouth VR).
• c. Lydia Rogers, b 27 Mar 1642 in Weymouth (VR 1:263) m. 19 Sep 1660 (Weymouth VR 2:166) Joseph White (deaths not recorded in Weymouth VR); removed to Mendon by 24 Mar 1664 (Mendon Annals, p 8)
• d. Hannah Rogers (abt 1640) m. 19 Sep 1660 (Weymouth VR 2:166) Samuel Pratt; she d. 16 Oct 1715 (Weymouth VR 2:319)
• e. Sarah Rogers (abt 1655; still single and underage at time of father’s 1661 will)

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http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=53728556

Birth: unknown Death: Feb. 11, 1661 Weymouth Norfolk County Massachusetts, USA

He was a Linen Weaver of Weymouth,MA. His origins are not known to me at this time.

Children: John Rogers Jr, Mary Rogers Rane(s), Lydia Rogers White, Hannah Rogers Pratt Bailey, and Sarah Rogers.

Family links:

Spouse:

1. Judith French? Rogers

Children:

1. John Rogers (1638 - 1710)*
2. Lydia Rogers White (1642 - ____)*
3. Hannah Rogers Bailey (1644 - 1724)*

• Calculated relationship

Burial: Unknown

Not related to the Mayflower ROGERS Family

Alternate info: Stratford Upon Avon, Warwick, England died 11 Feb 1661 in Weymouth, Norfolk, Massachusetts

Deacon John Rodgers immigranted to Boston before 1639. In 1639 hewas residing in Duxbury, Plymouth, Massachusetts and in 1644 was residing in Scituate, Plymouth, Masssachusetts. He executed a will on 8 Feb 1661 in Weymouth and it was proven 30 Apr 1662, also in Weymouth.

http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/m/i/n/Christine-L-Minima...

Disputed Parentage

Current theories:

• Supposedly parish records for Moulsham, Essex, England show a John Rogers being son of John Rogers. Moulsham is part of Chelmsford now[1]
• Possibly son of Thomas Rogers and Elizabeth/Elsgen Makin; this Thomas was not the Mayflower passenger.[2]
• He was NOT the son of the Mayflower Thomas Rogers. See this topic for a discussion of the distinction of John Rogers of Weymouth from two other contemporary John Rogers, including their respective wives.

Life in New England

• 1643: Proprietor in Weymouth
• Deacon, town officer
• Linen weaver

Who was the wife of Deacon John Rogers?

John Rogers was married to a Judith. But agreement about which one-- King, French or some other surname-- has not been reached. See Judith King or Judith French for more info.

Legacy

His will (transcribed below) mentions wife Judith, who is also identified as mother of his son John Rogers. Additional children are mentioned; those mentioned by name include: daughter Mary Rane; son-in-law John Rane; daughter Liddia Whitte; son-in-law Joseph White; daughter Hannah Pratt; son-in-law Samuel Pratt; daughter Sarah unmarried.

Will of Deacon John Rogers

.--8: 12: 1660 (8 February 1661)[3] Unto his beloued wife, Judith Rogers, his new end of his dwelling house, with one third part of ye Barne, and halfe his orchard and produce thereof,and halfe his pasture, adioyning to ye orchard, to be hers dureing her life.

His will is, that his sonne, John Rogers, shall pay vnto his mother, Judith, 20 bushells of Corne, yearly, one third in wheate, one third peases,one third in Indian Corne. If his sonne, John, refuse or fayle in paymt of ye said Corne, then his mother shall haue halfe ye land to improue aslong as she liues, viz. ye broke vpland.

Hee bequeaths vnto his wife, his feather bed, and all ye furniture thereunto belonging, with halfe of all his household goods, giueing hir power tobestow it on whom shee please; provided it be given to Deacon Rogers Children. Giues his wife, one Cow, and ye use of ye other Cow ye yeare Insueing, except his sonne, John, marry, then one Cow to be his. Hee giues one heifer to his wife, and halfe his swine and halfe his Goates and halfe his sheep. It is his will that his sonne, John Rogers, shall keep one Cow for his mother, and six Goates at winter, only, as long as shee liues. If John Rogers fayle in refuseing, then it is his will, that his wife, Judeth, shall have that part of his meadow adjoyning deacon Whitmans meadow, dureing her life.

Hee Bequathes vnto his dau. Mary Rane, his great lott which is 12 Acres, Bounded by Deacon Philips great lot, and further, giues her 40s.; vnto hisdau., Liddia Whitte, six Acres of land lying on ye east necke, or 5 pounds., which he leaues to his executors discretion, either to giue her ye landor ye fiue pound, soe it be donne in one yeares time after his decease.

He giues unto his dau. Hannah Pratt, 5 pounds, to be payd two yeeres after his decease. He giues his dau. Sarah, 15 pounds.; ten pounds to be payde A moneth after her marriage, ye other 5 pounds, two yeares after marriage. In case sheemarry not, shee is to haue 15 pounds; ten pounds at 18 yeares of age, and fiue pounds at 25 yeeres old.

Vnto his sonne, John Rogers, the Remaynder of all his estate, as houseing, Cattle, lands, &c. [said John paying his sisters out of that part of theestate given to him.]

If his sonne, John, dy without wife or Childe, then his sonne in law, Joseph White, shall haue ye land Adjoyneing Thomas Dons house, provoided Joseph White pay out of it to his sonne in law, John Rane, 10 pounds.

It is his will that his dau. Sarah haue ye Remaynder of his land, houseing, and orchard, in Case his sonne John dye as aboue expressed, viz. thatwhich belong to his sonne John. And Sarah, shall pay to John Rane, 5 pounds; and to Samuell Pratt, 8 pounds; and to Joseph White, 4 pounds. Further his will is, that William Richard, his Apprentice, shall serue ye Remaynder of his Apprentiship with his sonne, John, and that his sonneshall cause ye said William Richard shalbe taught his trade according to Indenture.

It is his will that his wife, Judeth, and his sonne, John Rogers, shall be joynt Executors of this his last will; alsoe, that Thomas White & John Holebrooke be overseers, and alsoe Thomas Dier.

Signed in ye prsence of John Rogers William Charde, Thomas Dyar, who deposed 30 April 1661.

Inventory of the estate taken 20: 12: 1660 (20 Feb 1661; needs checking; should be after deposition, above), by John Holbrooke. Amt. 275 pounds. Mentions "one servant boy that is apprentice," 10 pounds. Judith Rogers and John Rogers deposed, before Court, that this paper Containes a true Inventory of ye estate of the late John Roggers, of Weimouth, to the best of his knowledge.

Sources

   Banks, Topographical Dictionary, p. 42, 49.

   William B. Trask, "Abstract of the Earliest Wills on Record in the County of Suffolk, MA," NEHGS Register (July 1856)

   Charles H. Pope, The Pioneers of Massachusetts, 1900

   Josiah H. Drummond, The John Rogers Families in Plymouth & Vicinity; Portland, ME: Unknown (1895)

   John Cox Underwood, Lineage of the Rogers Family, NY: Press of W. E. Rudge (1911)

   Josiah H. Drummond, John Rogers of Marshfield & Some of his Descendants. West Hanover, MA: R.B. Ellis (1898)

   James Savage, Gen. Dictionary of the First Settlers of New England

   George Chamberlain, History of Weymouth

   Dean Crawford Smith, The Ancestry of Eva Belle Kempen? [check]

   Suffolk Probate Records, #264

   Descendants of Thomas White of Weymouth, MA

   Vital Records of Massachusetts to 1850; NEGHS (online database)

   Ramsburgh, Edith Roberts. Genealogical Department, "Daughters of the American Revolution Magazine" (The National Society of the Daughters of the American Revolution, March 1923) Vol. 57, No. 3, Whole No. 367, Page 172: #10672

Footnotes

  Banks' Topographical Dictionary, p. 42, 49

  Clifford L Stott, "The English Ancestry of Pilgrim Thomas Rogers and his Wife Alice (Cosford) Rogers," The Genealogist, 10: 2

  "Abstracts of Early Wills," in NEHGS Register 10(1856):265-266

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http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/MAYFLOWER/2005-11/113...

A query was made:

I have discovered a marriage between Judith French and Dea. John Rogers of
Weymouth, Ma, m.16 Apr 1639 Judith b. 1605 Misterton, Somerset, England I
Dea. JOhn Rogers ...the son of Thomas Rogers?

Craig replied

That is the correct marriage date for John Rogers (Thomas1, John2) -- but

to

Anna Churchman, not Judith French. What is your source?

This interchange again raises the questions about Deacon John Rogers of Weymouth MA, his parentage, and his marrige(s). In order to provide a point of reference for further discussion, I will quote from "The Ancestry of Eva Belle Kempton 1878-1908 Part I" 1996 by Dean Crawford Smith, CG and edited by Melinde Lutz Sanborn, F.A.S.G. published by the New England Historic Genealogical Society. Nothing more recent than this has come to my attention.

"Deacon JOHN ROGERS, linen weaver, born say 1610, died Weymouth, MA 11 February 1660/1 ((Vital Records of Weymouth, Massachusetts To The Year 1850, 3 vols. NEHGS 1910 2:334); married JUDITH (_____), living 30 April 1660 when her husband's will was proved (Suffolk Probate #264). It has been suggested that Judith was Judith French, age 20, who embarked for New England at Weymouth 20 March 1635/6 with Joseph Hull, minister of Somerset, in whose family she was a servant (Hotten's Lists, 285). If this is the case, then John Rogers must have met and married her in a very short time after his arrival in New England. No independent evidence supports this identification." His will mentions his wife as "Judeth." Their first child John was born about 1639.

Much more about Deacon John Rogers and Judith appears in Volume 19 West Country Ancestries, 1620-1643 Part III "Search for the Passengers of the MARY & JOHN 1630." 1993 The Mary & John Clearing House. Many of the key conclusions in this material are qualified as to their proof.

None of the above references has proved the following

1. That Deacon John Rogers was a son of any Thomas Rogers.

2. That Deacon John Rogers married Anna Churchman on 16 April 1639.

3. That Deacon John Rogers married Judith (FRENCH?) on 16 April 1639.

Certainly any proven additions or corrections to the above would be welcome because they do relate to a possible Mayflower lineage.

Rogers Finch

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Deacon John Rogers Born: Abt 1611 to 16 Married 16 Apr 1639 to Judith French Died: 11 Feb 1692, Weymouth, MA John Rogers, our ancestor and son of Thomas was born in England in 1611. He did not come with his father and brother, Joseph to Plymouth Colony in 1620. He came to Plymouth in 1631 with the last of the Leyden contingent. We know he was in Plymouth Colony on 25 March 1633 when he was taxed 9 shillings. The proof of his identity lies in a grant made 6 April 1640 to "Joseph Rogers and John Rogers his brother...fifty acres apiece of upland...at the North River." On the 16th of April 1639 he had married Ann Churchman, daughter of Hugh Churchman. They settled in Duxbury and in 1657 John represented the Township of Duxbury in the Massachusetts Legislature. In 1666 he was elected Constable for Duxbury. He and Ann had four children: John, Abigail, (our ancestor), Anna, and Elizabeth. According to the book "Descendants of Thomas Rogers" there were a number of land transactions in which John was involved between 1662 and 1685. As one of the "ancient freemen" he was given land in 1662 on the northerly side of Taunton. In 1664 he sold half his meadow northwest of "Joanes River," with the consent of wife Ann. This is the only time she is called by name except at their marriage. Several other land transactions took place over the years. He died 11 February 1692 and his will was probated 20 Sept. 1692. http://www.deloriahurst.com/deloriahurst%20page/2044.html

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ohn Rogers (son of Thomas Rogers and Elsgen McKim) was born Abt. 1618 in Stratford Upon Avon, Warwick, England, and died 11 Feb 1661 in Weymouth, Norfolk, Massachusetts2255.He married (1) Anna Churchman on Bef. 1636 in Plymouth, Plymouth, Massachusetts.He married (2) Judith French on 1636 in Weymouth, Norfolk, Massachusetts.He married (3) Judith King on 16 Apr 1639 in Duxbury, Plymouth, Massachusetts2255, daughter of George King and Joan (King).

Includes NotesNotes for John Rogers: Deacon John Rodgers immigranted to Boston before 1639.In 1639 hewas residing in Duxbury, Plymouth, Massachusetts and in 1644 was residing in Scituate, Plymouth, Masssachusetts.He executed a will on 8 Feb 1661 in Weymouth and it was proven 30 Apr 1662, also in Weymouth. More About John Rogers: Burial: Weymouth, Norfolk, Massachusetts. More About John Rogers and Anna Churchman: Marriage: Bef. 1636, Plymouth, Plymouth, Massachusetts. More About John Rogers and Judith French: Marriage: 1636, Weymouth, Norfolk, Massachusetts. More About John Rogers and Judith King: Marriage: 16 Apr 1639, Duxbury, Plymouth, Massachusetts.2255 Children of John Rogers and Judith French are:

Mary Rogers, b. 1637, Weymouth, Norfolk, Massachusetts.

   John Rogers, b. 1638, Weymouth, Norfolk, Massachusetts.

Children of John Rogers and Judith King are:

   Hannah Rogers, b. 23 Jul 1640, Weymouth, Norfolk, Massachusetts.

   +Lydia Rogers, b. 27 Mar 1642, Weymouth, Norfolk, Massachusetts2256, 2257, d. 08 May 1727, Mendon, Worcester, Massachusetts2258, 2259.

   Sarah Rogers, b. 1644, Weymouth, Norfolk, Massachusetts.

http://www.genealogy.com/ftm/m/i/n/Christine-L-Miniman/WEBSITE-0001...

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   The last Will and Testament of Deacon John Rogers this 8:12:mo:1660 being in perfect memory to our apprehension Who Bequeaths his [illegible] to the persons under mentioned and his spirit to the [Lord god] that gave it he gives and bequeaths unto his beloved wife Judeth Rogers the west end of his dwelling house with one third part of the Barne and halfe his orchard and p[ro]duce thereof and half his [ ] adjoyning to the orchard and these premises to be hers onely during her [life]

And further his will is that his sonne John Rodgers shall pay unto his mother Judeth Rodgers twenty bushells of Corne yearely one third to be paid in wheate one third peare & one third in Indian Corne if his son John refuse or fayle in payment of the said Corne, Then his mother Judeth shall have Half the land to Improve as long as shee lives viz the brok [torn]
Hee Bequeaths unto his wife Judeth his Featherbed and all the furniture thereunto belonging with half of all his houshold goods giveing her power to bestow it on whom shee please provided it be given to Deacon Rodgers Children
Further the said Deacon by this will gives unto his wife Judeth one cow and the use and profit of the other cow the yeare Insueing Except his son John marry then one cow to be his
He gives one heifer to his wife and halfe his swine and halfe his goates and half his sheep
It is his will that his sonne John Rodgers shall keep one cow for his mother and six Goats at winter onely as long as shee lives; If John Rodgers Fayle in refuseing then it is his will that his wife Judeth shall have that part of his medow that is adjoyneing to Deacon Whitmans medow dureing her life
Hee Bequeaths by this will unto his Daughter Mary Rane his great lott which is twelve Akers Bounded by Deacon Phillips great lott: and further gives her Fortie shillings
Further the said Deacon Rodgers gives unto his Daughter Lidda Whitte six Akers of land lying on the East necke or Five pound which he leaves to his Executors Discretion either to give her the land or the five pounds soe it be done in one yeares time after his decease
Hee gives unto his Daughter hanah pratt Five pounds to be paid two yeares after his decease
Hee Gives to his daughter Sarah Fourteen pounds ten pound thereof to be paid a month after her marridge the other five pound to be paid two years after her marridge And in case shee marry not shee is to have fiveteen pounds ten pounds at eighteen years of age and Five pound at Twenty five years old
Further the said Deacon [illegible] John Rodgers the Remaynder of all his [ ] goods chattells houshold stuffe & [ ] him his heires and [ ] provided that his son John Rodgers shall pay unto his Sis[ ] to the tenure of this his last will out of that part of the [ ] which is given byt he said Deacon unto his son John and not out [ ] that part which is given to his wife Judith
Further it is the said Deacons will that if his son John Rodgers dy without wife or child: that then his son in law Joseph White shall have the land that lyes adjoyneing to Thomas Dons house provided that Joseph White shall pay out of it to his son in law John Rane ten pound
It is his will allsoe that his daughter Sarah shall have the remaynder of his land houseing and orchard in case his son John dy as above expressed namely that which belong to his son John And Sarah shall pay to John Rane five pounds and to Samuel pratt Eight pound and to Joseph which fower pounds
Further his will is that William Richards his aprentice shall serve the Remaynder of his aprentiship with his son John And that his son shall cause the said william Richards shalbe taught his trade acording to Indenture
It is allsoe his will that his beloved wife judeth & his son John Rodgers shall be joynt Executors of this his last will and that even [ ]
It is allsoe his will and desire that his beloved Freinds Thomas White and John Holbrooke to be overseers of this his last will and testament and allsoe Thomas Dier
Signed in the presence of John Rogers

   William Charde

   Thomas Dyar

   (Proved 30 April 1660 [sic], Suffolk Probate #264)

20:12:1660

   A True Invoice of the Estate of Deacon John Rogers Lately Deaseased being apprised by us whose names are underwritten:

Item wearing apparell 06.00.00

   it Beds & bed cloths 14.00.00

   it pots kitties warming pan scillet fring pan

   seimer hangers 01.15.00

   it pewter vessel wth other Houshold vesels 02.10.00

   it Table Boards Bedsteads chaires & stooles 03.10.00

   It Two Chests 00.15.00

   It Cloth stufe & two Bule skines 01.00.00

   it Two muskquets two swords & two paier

   of Bandeleers 02.14.00

   it one loome wth other materialls belonging

   to it & wheels 05.00.00

   It one servant boy that is ye apprentice 10.00.00

   it one Horse 10.00.00

   it one yoake of oxen 12.00.00

   it Two Cowes & one calfe 09.00.00

   it Two Heifers 06.00.00

   it one Caffe of one year old 01.10.00

   it Sheep 05.00.00

   it Goate 07.00.00

   it Swine 03.06.00

   it one saddle cart & wheeles & plowe

   & plowe tackling 04.00.0

   it Wheat peas & Indian come 08.00.00

   it one Dwelling House Bame outhouse & orchard 60.00.00

   it Medow 26.00.00

   it Beaake land ten ackers 25.00.00

   it pasture Land ten ackers 20.00.00

   it Swamp Lands 3 ackers 01.10.00

   it Halfe one great Lot 15 ackers 05.00.0

   it one Great Lot 12 ackers 04.00.0

   it one Lot more of 3 ackers 04.00.0

   it one Lot of the Division of Comons 56 ackers 08.00.0

   it Hemp & flax 01.00.00

   it Barrels pailes & such vessells 01.00.0

   it old Lumber 01.00.0

   Sume Totall 275

   John Holbrook (Suffolk Probate #264)

Died 11 Feb 1660/61 Weymouth, Norfolk Co, Massachusetts Find all individuals with events at this location [2, 3] Probate 13 Apr 1661 [2] Notes

   John Rogers settled in Weymouth, MA, before 1643 (and is probably the "John Rogers" who was made a freeman of the Mass. Bay Colony 17 May 1645). It is likely that he was in Weymouth at least from 1638 as indicated by the extent of his lands.He was deacon of the First Church and a townsman (selectman) in 1645, 1646, 1652, 1654, 1657 and 1659. He was elected town recorder in 1651.

The Land of John Rogeres

   Fower acres in the west Field first given to himselfe bounded on the East with the land of Thomas Doget on the west with the high waie and on the south: on the north with John Whitmans salt marsh.

   Nine acres in the wester neck first given to Aingell Hollard bounded with a high waie on the East the Common on the west with Richard Silvesteres land on the north and the land of Edward Benet on the south

   One acre of salt marsh near burying Iland bought of Mr Newman bounded on the East with Tho Whites marsh on the west with Mr Parkeres on the south with the land of Robert Martin on the north with the sea

   Also twenty pole or thereabout be it more or less Lying at the head of the mill Brook for a watering place bounded on the south side with a white oak on the marsh with his owne Land & taking in the River on the East on the west with the land of Widdow Oatis

===Disputed Parents:=== Until confirmation of his parentage can be documented, he will remain unlinked to any specific parents. Current theories:

• Supposedly parish records for Moulsham, Essex, England show a John Rogers being a son of John Rogers. Moulsham is part of Chelmsford now.[3]
• Possibly son of Thomas Rogers and Elizabeth/Elsgen Makin; this Thomas was not the Mayflower passenger.[4]
• Another theory is that he was son of Barnabie Rogers (1588-1627) and Mary Wells (1587-1616). But without any source backing it up.
• He was NOT the son of the Mayflower passenger, Thomas Rogers. See this topic for a discussion of the distinction of John Rogers of Weymouth from two other contemporary John Rogers, including their respective wives. MayflowerDNA.org confirms that Deacon John Rogers is not the son of the Mayflower passenger, Thomas Rogers because Deacon John Rogers' Y-DNA haplogroup is R-FT226163, which conflicts with Thomas Rogers' Y-DNA haplogroup, R-FGC59523.[5]

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References

1. Reference: WikiTree Genealogy - SmartCopy: Dec 6 2024, 0:11:55 UTC
2. Removed birth data of 10/03/1609 at Moulsham, Essex, England as unsupported
3. https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Rogers-70